Serenbe Stories

Katie Kelly Bell Can't Wait to Travel Again

June 01, 2020 Serenbe / Katie Kelly Bell Season 3 Episode 6
Serenbe Stories
Katie Kelly Bell Can't Wait to Travel Again
Show Notes Transcript

Today we're talking with freelance journalist Katie Kelly Bell, who has been writing about food, wine, and travel for the last 15 years. While the pandemic has changed how she's able to cover destinations, she describes herself as a pragmatic optimist who envisions travel coming back little by little over the coming months. In this episode, we talk about HOW we'll be able to travel, rediscovering your own back yard this summer, and the 3 S's of what people will want WHEN travel opportunities do come back.

Mentioned In The Episode

Belmond Trains

Dr. Kate Mihevc Edwards - Precision Performance & Physical Therapy

Gil Kulers - Sommelier/Bev Manager at the Piedmont Driving Club

Jordan Winery as an example of destinations pivoting to accommodate social distancing

The Perfect Wellness Getaway Is Just Outside Of Atlanta - Article Katie Kelly Bell wrote for Forbes on Serenbe in 2018

Monica Olsen (1s):
Hey guys, it's Monica here. I wanted to tell you about a new podcast that I've started with my very good friend, Jennifer Walsh called Biophilic Solutions. Our last season of Serenbe Stories, Building a Biophilic Movement, was so popular that we decided to dedicate an entire podcast to it. Every other week Jennifer and I will sit down with leaders in the growing field of biophilia. We'll talk about local and global solutions to help nurture the living, social, and economic systems that we all need to sustain future generations. More often than not, nature has the answers. You can find Biophilic Solutions on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Subscribe and follow us today so you don't miss an episode. All right, now let's get back to Serenbe Stories.

Monica Olsen (56s):
Serenbe is a place where people live, work, learn, and play in celebration of life's beauty. And we're here to share the stories that connect residents and guests to each other and to nature. This is Serenbe Stories.

Monica Olsen (1m 22s):
Today we're talking with freelance journalist, Katie Kelly Bell, who has been writing about food, wine, and travel for the past 15 years. While the pandemic has changed how she's been able to cover destinations, she describes herself as a pragmatic optimist who envisions travel coming back little by little over the coming months. In this episode, we talk about how we'll be able to travel, rediscovering your own backyard this summer, and the three S's of what people will want when travel opportunities do come back.

Monica Olsen (1m 53s):
But first, Serenbe Stories is brought to you by The Inn at Serenbe. The Inn is nestled in the rolling countryside of bucolic Serenbe, where guests can walk on the 15 miles of trails through preserved forest land, the wildflower meadow, and the animal village.

Monica Olsen (2m 5s):
You can relax by the pool, hot tub, or in rocking chairs on the wraparound porch. Play on the croquet lawn, swings, and in-ground trampolines. Connect with nature and each other all while staying in luxurious rooms on The Inn grounds or within the community of Serenbe.  Book your stay today at serenbeinn.com.

Monica Olsen (2m 22s):
So I want to welcome everybody back today. Today we have Katie Kelly Bell, who is a freelance journalist and who has been to Serenbe numerous times. She wrote a really lovely article, a travel article in Forbes. I think it was 2019, or sorry, 2018. And Katie's experience bridges print, digital, television, she's coauthored a book about Ireland travel, senior editor at the Wine Report that I want to hear all about,

Monica Olsen (2m 49s):
And as well as CNN's airport channel. She lives here in Atlanta with her three kids and her husband. Well, a couple of them are out of school, but they're all back now during COVID and she enjoys playing tennis. Katie, thank you so much for being with us today and welcome to Serenbe Stories.

Katie Kelly Bell (3m 6s):
I am delighted to be here and it's just great to see all of you.

Steve Nygren(3m 9s):
Okay. Glad you joined our conversation today.

Katie Kelly Bell (3m 11s):
I'm excited. There's a lot to talk about.

Monica Olsen (3m 14s):
There is a lot to talk about. The travel industry is in a bit of disarray right now. And when you came to us originally you popped in, I want to say in 2018 to do a story, and I think you came with your daughter and a good friend, but tell us just a little quickly, like you've lived in Atlanta for a number of years. You've been in the south for awhile. Did you know about Serenbe before? Or how did you discover it before we had you down?

Katie Kelly Bell (3m 39s):
I have known about Serenbe probably since the beginning, because I have been writing about the wine and food scene in Atlanta for a long time. So I knew Steve through that and his tremendous success in that area, you know, and when he and his wife kind of migrated and started the Serenbe project, everybody was honestly a little bit of head scratching and, and sort of wondering what this was going to be. And, you know, really I'm, you were so far ahead of your time in that I, I grew up going to the woods every weekend. My father was an Irish farm boy. So when, when he moved to America, he wanted a cabin in the woods, so he can have his farm life. So I had that in my DNA. So I understood what you were doing with Serenbe.

Katie Kelly Bell (4m 20s):
I was like, oh, I kind of get that. But there were a lot of people who, who just wondered, why are you literally just putting a place in the middle of nowhere? What's that about? And so I personally just have loved watching the trajectory of Serenbe, because it has really unfolded into this incredible thing that just, you know, attracts people from all over really, probably the world at this point. You know, it it's something that I understood as a child, everyone needs, but I think you saw that before everybody else. And now of course, looking back, everyone's like, oh, that's a great idea, it makes total sense. But you know, it was definitely, and you know, certainly at the time, you know, a question for a lot of people.

Steve Nygren (5m 0s):
Yes. Everyone thought we were totally crazy.

Katie Kelly Bell (5m 1s):
Yeah. I surely I didn't think you were crazy, but I heard it. I heard a buzz.

Steve Nygren (5m 6s):
Of course I was used to that because when I, when, you know, when I was a believer in Midtown, Atlanta in the seventies, everyone thought that was crazy too. And it's fun to read some of the feasibility studies now this many years later that, you know, were so wrong.

Katie Kelly Bell (5m 19s):
Yeah. Yeah. And look at Midtown it's thriving. It's incredible.

Monica Olsen (5m 26s):
Yeah. Well, and the place-making of Midtown, you know, whether that's the park as a destination or now the BeltLine with all the culinary and hotels, sort of a budding write-up to that, you know, that really is what has been incredible about Serenbe is having it be a destination as well as a place to live. When you came I think you were able to come see theater, which unfortunately is on hiatus right now, but, and this was way before Mado hadn't happened. So Steve was taking you around and tell us the story about the golf cart. If you remember.

Katie Kelly Bell (6m 3s)
So we had a fabulous tour and it was a breathtaking tour because I really had left Serenbe, the

Katie Kelly Bell (6m 10s):
Prior trip was, you know, sort of a small quaint neighborhood here and there and then The Inn. And on this golf cart tour, it was just extravagant what was happening, you know, the, the Mado development, the Mado is it Mado development? Mado, the, the, you know, all the wellness you were putting in place, the pool, which of course on the golf cart tour, we did get stuck in the mud by the pool. So we, we had to get extricated, but it was, yeah. I, I mean, it took my breath away just seeing how it had really transformed. I felt like that was the tipping point when I was going around that tour with you, seeing everything that was happening.

Steve Nygren (6m 47s):
And when were you last here? Was that the last you were here?

Katie Kelly Bell (6m 49s):
So that tour with you and then my husband and I came back about six months later and just had lunch at The Hill and I took him around and showed him everything you showed me and sort of talked to him about what, you know, you were talking about with wellness and just the whole living concept and how you can have sort of convivial, neighborly living, but then still be in the forest all the time and not feel isolated. And you know, that there was just this, like the medical benefit of that, that isn't really, you know, that, that's what they talk about in science. That's just not that piece, but he, so we both loved it. We had a great lunch and said, well, you know, our nest is almost empty, so we don't know where we want to land, and maybe it would be Serenbe, you know, it's, that still hasn't been decided.

Katie Kelly Bell (7m 33s):
And we're, you know, exploring a lot of things, but everything we explore has to have a nature contingent.

Steve Nygren (7m 39s):
Well do come see us because a lot's happened since then.

Katie Kelly Bell (7m 42s):
Yeah. I can only, and you've actually recruited my favorite physical therapist. Kay.

Steve Nygren (7m 46s):
Oh, really?

Katie Kelly Bell (7m 47s):
I'm sorry. Kate. Yes. Kate. Yeah, she, she is the one person who got my husband's back back to zero. And, you know, I was, I was not surprised that you found her because really the best go to Serenbe.

Steve Nygren (8m 1s):
We're, we're finding that they're really coming from all over and we're it, it's fun to see that happening. And you no longer will get stuck by the pool. So it's

Katie Kelly Bell (8m 12s):
The mud's gone. Exciting.

Monica Olsen (8m 14s):
Now you can swim in it, yeah. So your daughter, I know your youngest is 17 years old, so yeah, so you have a few years to sort of think about that, but tell us how, I know that you grew up in Missouri and went to school in Nashville. So you've really been in the south for a number of years, but tell us a little bit about your trajectory as a writer, a journalist, how you got into it, and then how you got into sort of the travel, food, and wine side.

Katie Kelly Bell (8m 41s):
So that, you know, when I graduated from Vanderbilt, I had a, I got a master's in teaching and I moved to Atlanta because I got an offer to teach fifth grade, which is my favorite grade. And I taught school for six or seven years, got married, taught some more, and then got pregnant and decided to stay home because I thought, you know, that would be the better role for me. I was too much of a control freak to let anyone else be in charge of my child. So I, I stayed home and after about 18 months started to lose my mind. And I actually had a neighbor, cause I love wine, and I talk about wine all the time, and I had kind of a reputation in the neighborhood for being kind of a wine freak. And a neighbor said to me, oh, you should write for the Wine Report.

Katie Kelly Bell (9m 23s):
You know, they're always looking for writers. And this was in the nineties when like media was just blowing up. I mean, you couldn't find a writer, people were, so there's a note of desperation to a lot of editors. I was lucky, my timing was perfect because I had no journalism degree I just love to write. I'd always written. I, you know, journaled my whole life, like writing was a form of therapy for me. So I thought, oh wow. I could connect the dots and put wine that I love with writing. Like, that's brilliant. So I harassed this editor who's Gil Kulers and who is now the sommelier at the Piedmont driving club. And, and Gil became a good friend and agreed to give me an assignment. And, you know, he took a risk on me, but I did a good job and, and we hit it off and I created a portfolio.

Katie Kelly Bell (10m 9s):
And then I just spent the next two years, you know, listening in to, meeting other writers for coffee, you know, I bought books on how to write, how to pitch that was back when you wrote a pitch out on a piece of paper and put it in an envelope and mailed it. I mean, can you imagine right? And then I, you know, you followed up with phone calls and so I just pitched everyone. I didn't know better. I didn't think, wow, I don't have any, you know, I just was like, Hey, these are my story ideas and a good editor just wants a good idea. I mean, you know, it's great if you have been writing for a hundred years, but if you've got a good idea. And so I pitched Atlanta Magazine and I made a great connection with an editor there and she loved my story ideas and we hit it off.

Katie Kelly Bell (10m 52s):
And once I kind of got plugged into Atlanta Magazine and the Wine Report and started getting a steady diet of work, people started calling, you know, and, and the doors started opening on their own. And then the more opportunities I had, the more incredible story ideas I would come across. And, you know, I, I love wine, I love travel, but I'm not an expert. I'm just a good storyteller. I think that's what, you know, that's what I love about writing is I get to tell people's stories. I love the human character. I love our, the humanity in everything I think is fascinating. So being able to tell stories that bring people to life, you know. Wine's kind of boring by itself. But it's much more fascinating when you talk about the winemaker who, you know, likes to farm with a plow and why he thinks that way, or, you know, the woman who started her own hotel and how she's doing that.

Katie Kelly Bell (11m 40s):
And I dunno, those parts are just, kind of build on themselves. So yeah, over time, literally through a lot of scrappy hustle and a lot, a lot of negative, being shot down, being told, no, you know, learn from your mistakes, I was able to, so I'm doing this for 15 years now.

Monica Olsen (12m 0s):
And how has COVID impacted that? I mean, did you travel a lot or, you know, now obviously you're, I know we're sort of out of shelter in place, but obviously not heading all over the country at this point. What's going on in the day to day for you?

Katie Kelly Bell (12m 13s):
COVID has devastated my, my personal travel schedule. I mean, I had a trip to Sweden. I had a trip to Champagne and I would travel probably every four to six weeks for about four or five days. So yeah, that's been just gutted, which has been fine. I I'm still here. I'm healthy. I have my family now work for writers is, has really frozen up. I wouldn't say it's dried up, but I do think, you know, most outlets are tightening up their budgets. They're not working with anyone but staff, some of them are taking their, like Delta Sky is gone. They just folded up. They're no longer.

Monica Olsen (12m 52s):
That's so sad, I know.

Katie Kelly Bell (12m 54s):
So I think we're starting to see a lot of that. And I, I do feel that the outlets that were kind of buoyed by this great economy, you know, it's the way it goes. If you're just barely squeaking by, you're not really going to be there when it's over. So I do,

Katie Kelly Bell (13m 11s):
And I actually have some journalist friends who are going  in other careers. They just feel like now, as they've been thinking about a switch, so now is the time, you know, it's, this is a bide your time and wait, But I think also, you know, this is the job of, of everyone, but even a journalist most of all, is you've gotta be able to pivot and see where, where are people looking for content? Who, technical writing, wellness, and health writing. You know, I got in contact with an interior designer who has more work than she knows what to do with and needs a writer to help with her projects. So I, you know, I think it's, if you can pivot and you can hustle, you'll, you'll do okay, but it's stressful.

Katie Kelly Bell (13m 51s):
It's just stressful. And it's hard. It's hard to see, you know, editors you love, you know, have to tell people that they're going to have to let them go. And, you know, but I I've seen this before. I mean, you know, this business is, especially media, it's so subject to the whims of, of the economy in the world. And the weird thing is that engagement online is, is greater than it has ever been. People are reading more than ever, but the ad dollars aren't following, so

Monica Olsen (14m 19s):
Right. Everybody's cut their ad budgets. But then, you know, they're trying to pick it up with subscribers. But I even saw, I think it was yesterday that the Atlantic monthly had to cut staff and then, you know, Curb is gone, you know, which is sort of a big loss.

Monica Olsen (14m 30s):
I think for markets on real estate writing. It is going to be an interesting time. And, and I do think that, you know, we actually had an interview with Ford Fry yesterday and talked about the restaurant industry. And I don't know if you felt this way, but I think we felt like Q4 last year, and in this first quarter, before everything hit, it just felt like going gangbusters and the market was great and the industry was great and the economy was great and then just halted. But I do think, I'm such a, you know, a Ford, you know, calls himself an optimist, right. Obviously his restaurant and I, and I'm a very hopeful person too. So I think that it is an opportunity to pivot and rethink, you know, what do people want?

Monica Olsen (15m 17s):
What do we really stand for? Whether you're a restaurant or a hotel. What kind of trends or responses are you seeing in the travel industry right now? What, what are you hearing? What are you seeing?

Katie Kelly Bell (15m 31s):
Well, I think the word pivot is the key word. I've, I've been just blown away by how clever some of the pivots have been. And the trends I'm seeing in travel and, you know, just on the seminars I'm sitting in on, and this with other experts and travel professionals, is that they're actually getting more bookings and they thought they were going to get, so everyone's reporting higher numbers. And that doesn't mean they're the numbers they had back in early March.

Katie Kelly Bell (15m 57s):
But Delta thought that their number would go up 10% and they're getting closer to 30%. So numbers are going up in the right direction. And I do think everyone's feeling that I I'm, I would say I'm an optimistic pragmatist. Okay. I mean, reality is the virus is out there, but I think people are asking, not just, you know, should I travel? It's how I can travel and when I can travel. Everyone, and I ask every person I see, the doctor, that checkout person at the grocery store, would you get on a plane? Would you, where would you go? Cause I'm curious as a journalist, what are people thinking? And I've never had anyone say, oh, no way.

Katie Kelly Bell (16m 38s):
They all say, yes, I'm ready to go somewhere. I, you know, maybe I'm going to drive. I don't know. I might get on a flight. I mean, there's a lot of maybe about flying, but I think the trends are going the right direction. I think that, you know, we've all kind of been sort of saturated in that go travel thing. I mean, it's, it's been that way for a while. So I think people want to get back to it. And they've just trying to figure out how.

Steve Nygren (17m 4s):
With, with working from anywhere, do you think train travel might come back?

Katie Kelly Bell (17m 9s):
Oh, that's a curious, you know, no one's talked about that. No, one's talked about that in fact. They talk about car just because that's the obvious

Steve Nygren (17m 18s):
Right. But then you're driving. But if you could be on a train and still working.

Katie Kelly Bell (17m 22s):
And that was the beauty of flying was I love flying because I could plug in my earbuds, someone brought me a cocktail. and I just had to watch movies or work on my, my computer. And they brought my food to me and I loved it. I didn't have to think about anything but me. And that, same with train travel. So it would be great to see that, to see that kind of be the new form would be wonderful.

Steve Nygren (17m 43s):
It'd be a great pivot for someone to put a couple of really, cars that are designed for that.

Katie Kelly Bell (17m 48s):
Yeah, definitely. Or, you know, hotels could take over a train and you know, like we've got the Belmond trains, which I would just love to get on one of those, but there's nothing in the United States like that.

Steve Nygren (17m 58s):
Yeah. It'd be great. That's a big opportunity for someone. You mentioned that you've been impressed with some of the people, how they've pivoted, who, who comes to mind, what are some of the stories?

Katie Kelly Bell (18m 7s):
You know, for instance like Jordan winery, they, you know, their, the, the restrictions in California are really tough. And so they, they still can't open the winery, but they were allowing people to hike. So if you have acreage, you could do, you could go hike. That was fine. So Jordan quickly said, oh, we're going to have the picnic hike. So you come to the Jordan winery, we sell you wine and a picnic. We can't pour anything for you. We can't pour you a taste, but we can sell you this package, and then we'll take you on a guided hike of our Jordan winery, socially distant. They sold out in the first, like she said, 48 hours we sold out. So the clamor for it.

Monica Olsen (18m 44s):
That's amazing.

Katie Kelly Bell (18m 45s):
Yeah. So brilliant. Right? That's just brilliant.

Katie Kelly Bell (18m 48s):
And then when they're ready to open, you know, the California government saying, you know, you have to be outside for your tasting. So they're creating their outdoor, like they're really actually building out all their outdoor spaces. And they've decided now is the time to renovate the inside of the winery. So they just like, we're, this is how it's going to be. Everything's outside. We're going to make it work. And I saw a restarauteur, I don't remember what city it was in, but she put up shower curtains between, clear shower curtains between each table.

Steve Nygren (19m 14s):
I saw that.

Katie Kelly Bell (19m 16s):
Like that's smart. I mean, it's just, you know, it's kind of kooky, but Hey, all right. That's okay. That's clever. And then you don't have to spread those tables out. You can seat your usual dining room. It's just, you don't have. Yeah. And so I was like, oh, that's really smart. And then the wine delivery has just been, wineries that have been able to get their wines out there. Cause delivery of alcohol has been off the charts off the charts and they have quickly figured out, okay. So we have to get all our wine into the warehouse now and we need to stagger deliveries and one driver per truck. And so how can we do this? And it it's just, the pivoting has been really extraordinary. That's so American to me, this just the hustle and the sort of the creative thinking and just willing to throw anything out there and see how it works has been, it's really neat to watch.

Monica Olsen (20m 5s):
When you're back next, we have a wine shop that's opened since you've been here, just call it the wine shop, but it's beautiful and wonderful wine. You'll completely enjoy it.

Monica Olsen (20m 15s):
And the guy who owns it really knows his stuff, but they, you know, did a really nice wine tasting business here and there. And so they're thinking about bringing back where you would have times, right? So you would come in and you would have your time. And that would be sort of, and you know, maybe you could wait outside, but that was sort of how they were thinking about doing it. Cause it's a really small shop, right? So how do you pivot and still give people an experience?

Katie Kelly Bell (20m 44s):
That's a smart idea. People, people love one-on-one time anyway, when it comes to wine. They really don't want to have to find you and get your attention. So that, the, who knows that might last, I mean, you know, you have your professional appointment.

Monica Olsen (20m 57s):
Exactly, charge a little bit of a premium. And I think, you know, wine clubs are obviously, especially with the delivery are really, really great. One of the things that we've seen, which I think is sort of interesting, sort of to the point about the work from home, you know, we've seen like a huge influx in interest, whether that's calls or search or actual bookings, of extended stays. Which is really fascinating to me. And people looking for rentals at Serenbe are up, you know, double, triple from last year. Are you hearing that from other hotels that, you know, kind of have a little more of a destination type aspect? I thought that was really interesting.

Katie Kelly Bell (21m 37s):
Yeah. I actually am hearing that. And I know what, what comes to mind are the dude ranches out west, several of them, they, they never closed because people said, you know, we're driving, we're coming from, you know, St. Louis and we're going to stay the whole month and just put us up in the cabin. So I think the extended stay, especially as the economy started to sort of crack back open and people feel like one of the anxieties was, if I get in my car, will I be able to find gas, will there be a place open to eat? And so now you can kind of feel comfortable that there will be, and you want that drive to sort of fit a window of maybe one stop. So six hour drive, seven hour drive. And we did it in the beginning of May. We packed everything in the car, brought the extra monitors,

Katie Kelly Bell (22m 21s):
My son brought his dumbbells, whatever. And we really literally brought the kitchen sink, but we were, we just cruised down to Hilton head and we just settled in and it was amazing. It was just so special to be there with the frogs and the alligators and the birds. And, you know, it was still locked up. There weren't restaurants to go to, but we worked and we got in our rhythm down there. And I think, you know, I, I, my neighbors started hearing about what we did and then they started booking a week. So people are, listen, you know, we're not going back to work anytime soon. So if that laptop can fit in your car, then you know, why not just take this experience somewhere where you have a view or you have a walking path or something just that changes this up a little bit.

Steve Nygren (23m 7s):
I mean, this is happening all over. Everyone I've talked to is, is has said that, you know, second homes are all occupied with the owners and rentals in these places are almost impossible now because of that. So how much do you think will, will change? I see where a lot of your tech people now have decided that you can work from home. I think Facebook just said that that's it. This is going to be a forever. And that's going to change where, you know, people have second homes where they just had to go visit and suddenly now they can actually work out of there.

Katie Kelly Bell (23m 36s):
I totally agree. I think that, I have a friend who's an accountant with Coke and they just said, you know what? We're not even going to think about coming back till November. Maybe we never come back. And that's, you know, I think more, more and more conversations are happening that way. My, my sister is a partner in a global law firm and she said, I don't ever need to go back to my office. I don't need to get on the L and do that. So, you know, that's, that is, I think, want to be going to be one of the tectonic shifts. And I think it was sort of leaning that way, but, you know, habits are habits and, you know, I need the FaceTime or whatever. And I think that when this is all said and done, if people start looking, pulling back and looking at it and thinking, well, by not going to work, I save hours in traffic,

Katie Kelly Bell (24m 19s):
I save carbon emissions cause I'm not in my car. You know, I'm more with my family. I just, I'm more connected to my community that I live in. There's a lot of value in, you know, working from home in a reasonable way. And then having that quality time with your work, maybe you get together for a drink somewhere, or you go play golf or, you know, you just meet up somehow. And you do need that social interaction with your colleagues, but I think everyone's discovered that you can get it, you know, there's, it's not, you don't have to be in the office for it. So I think the work from home or work from anywhere is, is definitely gonna be a new part of our world after COVID.

Steve Nygren (24m 58s):
And what we're hearing is employers, they were afraid people wouldn't be as productive and they're finding they're all more productive and that's, I think that'd be the real turn.

Katie Kelly Bell (25m 6s):
Yeah. And don't you wonder why? I mean, I've worked from home my whole life. I've never had, except when I taught school, then that's the only thing you can't do really from home, but there is, is it, are you more productive because you're not in traffic or because you, I, I I've, I've actually wondered about that. Like, what is it that's making people more productive? and I'm not sure I'm really asked that question a lot, but it's true. It's across the board true. They're getting more done in less time.

Steve Nygren (25m 32s):
Well, you have more time because you're not spending the time transporting yourself from one place to another. And chances are people are in a better mood.

Katie Kelly Bell (25m 38s):
Yeah. They're not as aggravated.

Steve Nygren (25m 41s):
I mean I found back in the restaurant days our accounting department that didn't matter. And we were having trouble getting reports out by the time Friday afternoon came. And so we finally said, if you get it done by the time you leave Thursday, you can have Friday off. We got the reports done. So I think, I think it's just the mood you're in and, and, and your goal. So if you're home, you can get squeeze it all into a fewer hours and have extra time wherever the office you can't do that.

Katie Kelly Bell (26m 15s):
Which I, I guess I, yeah, I I've known that forever. I just, I know how much I have to get done and what time I need to get it done. And, you know, in between I can walk the dog or, you know, go play tennis or, you know, do whatever.

Monica Olsen (26m 30s):
Yeah, yeah. Somebody, I, I don't know if I read it or where I saw it, but it's like, are you working from home? Are you living in your office? I was like, oh,

Steve Nygren (26m 40s):
So that's a new trend. I think I just sent you a note on that Monica, is the neighborhood workspace. So you can, you can walk out your front door, down the street and have, you know, that office space, if you need it, whether it's a controlled phone booth or some of the office amenities, but you're not having to get in the car.

Monica Olsen (27m 1s):
Yeah, I think that's a great point that the sort of co-working spaces or the WeWorks obviously are going to be pretty up ended, but maybe it will be, they're still gonna need those spaces, but what are they gonna look like? And are they going to be as big, right? Cause there's a lot of concern about that real estate. Do we need it?

Steve Nygren (27m 21s):
People are getting addicted and not having to get in the car. So if you could do it within walking distance.

Monica Olsen (27m 27s):
No, I, I drove up to Atlanta the other day to take care of something and I thought, God.

Katie Kelly Bell (27m 34s):
And that's not really even traffic. That's not bad.

Monica Olsen (27m 36s):
No, there was no traffic. It only took me like 35 minutes, but it was just a funny, you know, the, up and the back and the few errands I had to do, I've just been walking here, but there were a couple of things I just couldn't get done. And I thought, wow, that was kind of a time sink. All of that stuff. I wonder if I could have had all of that delivered or somehow planned better so I didn't have to make that drive. It was, it was, it is really reshifting how I'm thinking about how time is utilized. You know, the other thing that we're seeing, which is maybe slightly less of the travel, but I think it, it could affect it is, you know, where people are living, right?

Monica Olsen (28m 16s):
Because again, the work from home is driving like, not only can you go take an extended stay or go to Hilton Head for a month or Serenbe, you can, you can live anywhere. So if you always wanted to live near your parents or you want to live in a less expensive neighborhood, you know, are you hearing about that? You know, I mean, I've read a bunch of stuff where people are moving to rural communities. And I think people will recognize pretty quickly that that isolation is not what they're really looking for. They think they want it, but it's really that access to nature. Are you seeing that or is anybody talking about that from,

Katie Kelly Bell (28m 51s):
I think that's been happening, like you said, for, for some time and I haven't heard it being discussed so much at the moment, but I think it's, I think it's sort of happening without us knowing it.

Katie Kelly Bell (29m 3s):
I hear a lot of people, a lot of journalists I'm friends with, leaving New York. They're just like, you know what, I'm going to go. I'm going to Connecticut. Or I'm in Phoenix or I've just left the city and I'm going to sublet my place. And I think what what's happened and has been happening for some time for several years is that big cities, everybody was going there for the jobs they became untenably expensive. And so everyone said, oh, I can't afford to live here and have a family. This isn't, this isn't life. So they've been trying to find a way out to go back to rural communities, because I do think everything got out of balance. The rural communities were getting gutted and the cities were just jammed and it was sad to see, and I think this particular pandemic will will bring balance back.

Katie Kelly Bell (29m 49s):
That's my hope so that these people who have been in the cities can see this job's doable from anywhere. I'm going to move to a smaller town outside of New York, and I'm going to do it from there and I'm going to have a yard and I'm going to raise my children and I'll be able to afford it. So I think this is sort of almost that, that kick out the door that we, some of us needed to just say, you know what, it's time. And I, like the Serenbe's of the world should hopefully benefit from that because people are ultimately always looking for their little space to live with their family, but they want community. And I think big city was the only community we had for a while and it got too expensive. And now it's suddenly, you know, well that charming little town that I can get this cute little home in and then five other friends move.

Katie Kelly Bell (30m 38s):
And I do think it will have the effect of reshaping the rural communities.

Monica Olsen (30m 42s):
One of the things that we had already, you know, we had always hoped because Chatt Hills, the city that Serenbe sits in, you know, is sort of 40,000 acres, that there is this vision of sort of really bringing back an agrarian economy that's already happening. And one of the big things that I don't know if we talked to you about that, the Rodale Institute out of Pennsylvania is opening a Southeastern regional resource center. This fall will kind of be launched, but they brought a farmer and a scientist, and they're going to do side-by-side trials. And hopefully that will continue to grow the interest and bring people out to get involved.

Monica Olsen (31m 19s):
You know, maybe people who are pivoting out of a job that they maybe were on the verge of leaving, they can come do something, you know, you know, in a rural setting and more of a small town, know your neighbor kind of way, which will be interesting to see those trends play out.

Katie Kelly Bell (31m 35s):
I think. Yeah. And I, I think people want to feel like intellectual stimulation will be there when they, you know, somehow you can sort of addicted to the idea that it can only be in a city, but you know, college towns are some of the best, like Chapel Hill, Athens. They're great, cool towns, really dynamic and energetic. I think that can happen like with the Rodale Institute. And so, you know, once that starts to go along with the people, then yeah, it's going to be reshaping.

Monica Olsen (32m 5s):
One of the things that I was curious about is, cause we talked a little bit about what you're seeing in sort of trends and what people, how people have pivoted, but tell me what, how, what do you see? You know, what does the recovery look like over the next sort of six to 24 months? I mean, we know that we're not going to suddenly The Inn at Serenbe back in the, you know, whatever occupancy in the 80% range, you know, we'll be happy, we'll be happy, but you know, we we're trying to figure out how do you live at a 40 to 50% knowing that, you know, maybe travel doesn't come back as quickly. We hope that it will, but what are you seeing? You know, what, what do you think is going to come back first? Where are going to be the challenges?

Katie Kelly Bell (32m 42s):
I think it's three, the three, S's the three things that are on everyone's mind is space. Where can I go where I'll have space? Is it safe, safe to get there safe when I'm there? And is it sanitized? So I think the third one, you know, sanitized goes with safe, but we've probably all experienced that sort of exp moment where you go into one shop to get something and no one's wearing a mask and they don't seem to care. And you say, well, I'm not going to go back there for a while. And so you go to this store that has their protocols in place and they're iron clad and already stores in Atlanta are getting reputations for one way or the other. So most of the top hotel chains have partnered with, you know, Johns Hopkins or Emory or Mayo Clinic.

Katie Kelly Bell (33m 25s):
And they have consultants on hand to literally go through the property and identify, you know, touch points that would need to be the safest of all. I know that some of these properties have hygiene concierges. So I think those that's really something that all these properties have taken to heart. And then the space part is really where I think it will start first. People are going to go to places where they can spread out. The big beach at Hilton head, the mountains in Colorado, where can I hike and bike and still feel like I got away and had a vacation, you know, are number one. And I think certainly drive times are also part of that by car. You know, international, unfortunately until, you know, the 14 day quarantine restrictions are lifted and the borders are open, you know, I'd get on a plane tomorrow and go to France.

Katie Kelly Bell (34m 14s):
I would have no qualms about it, but I can't. So, you know, I don't know how international will unfold because it really depends on the governments that run those nations. So that's, that's hard, that's a tough crystal ball to see, but everyone I talked to wants to go somewhere, wants to get out of town and is looking for that place that they could go with their family, or maybe another multifamily travel to, you know, rent a Villa and stay somewhere on the beach or in the forest or by the lake, I think will be that big, hot ticket this summer. And some people will just stay the whole summer and make it their vacation slash work from home. I also think though, I wouldn't rule out the cities because how appealing is it to think you can go to New York city and have all those attractions line free?

Katie Kelly Bell (35m 3s):
Like really probably. Yeah. I mean, you know, you don't have to queue up for the empire state building. The metropolitan is you can wander the halls and look at the art without, you know, crowds of people just jamming every painting you want to see. Like that's very appealing to me. And I, again, it goes to each institution's skill at handling the distancing and the sanitizing. And so I think I wouldn't rule it out. But right now everyone's talking about, I, everyone wants to go somewhere. They just are kind of sorting out how and when, and June 1st seems to be a big opening date for a lot of hotel properties.

Katie Kelly Bell (35m 43s):
And I know Vail Resorts, my son works for them, they're opening hotels June 1st and they're hoping the lifts will open July 1st. So, you know, they're still planning on getting the season in and you know if, gosh, if you could think, well, what's a safe, socially distant spacious place. The Rocky mountains would be cool. Or, you know, the grand canyon. It's time to see your national parks. I think that's, you know, camping, all that stuff, those almost like back to the fifties, you know, get the family in the car and let's go somewhere and explore America. I feel like that's like, that's a kind of the, it's very retro. It's going to be a retro sort of summer vacation this year.

Steve Nygren (36m 21s):
I bet RVs are going to be in high demand.

Katie Kelly Bell (36m 24s):
Yes. A hundred percent. Yeah. Yeah. No summer camps, you know, everything everybody's busy-ness has been put on hold. So we're all looking for what that solution's going to be to our normal busy-ness.

Steve Nygren (36m 38s):
We are reopening our summer camp here with some guidelines.

Katie Kelly Bell (36m 40s):
Oh good, good. Yeah. I think you can do it within reason. I think not everything, you know, and, and don't ever rule out, like we've learned so much about this virus in the last nine weeks. I'm very curious to know what the next nine weeks show us. I just, the progress in intelligence about it has been remarkable. So, you know, right now what I'm saying now, I didn't think I would be saying four weeks ago. I, so I've just, you know, it's important to read data-driven science articles and make your decisions and you know, whatever, the CDC is, the guiding light and almost everybody is following their guidelines. So, you know, if you have your science and your, you know, your family in hand, go for it.

Monica Olsen (37m 25s):
Yeah definitely. And like, I know Steve, you had been talking to somebody over at InterContinental Group and they were saying that the luxury side locally, you know, they kind of felt like would come back first. Do you remember that conversation Steve?

Steve Nygren (37m 35s):
They're saying very much the same thing. And this was some of the Six Senses people. And they had just, Six Senses under Intercontinental. They have 16 hotels that they closed worldwide. And two weeks ago they opened Vietnam. It was their first and they were totally booked, a hundred percent booked. And the difference was, is most of it are much, much higher percent of domestic, both ex-pats and people that live there, then they, then they were normal too. So I think this reenforces where people are going to travel, but it's going to be domestic travel everywhere. And they said that they, you know, well, I think we all see the convention business is

Steve Nygren (38m 19s):
What's going to be some of the slowest to come back. And so that's your, your, your bigger mid range hotels that have lived on convention business. So the destination will come back and they'll, you know, that'll be in the luxury market.

Katie Kelly Bell (38m 32s):
Yeah. Events are going to be hurting for a while. That's, that's an unfortunate, there's really nothing you can do to make an event a safe experience right now.

Steve Nygren (38m 41s):
Well, and that triggers a lot because you know, New York I'll take as the example, someone, a 30 year old New Yorker said, I'm, I'm leaving. And I'm not sure when I'll go back, because part of why I'm here and putting up with what I do is the energy that I just feel with everything closed. The energy is not there. So I, you know what I'm there for? And you look at these many of these small restaurants can't survive on 50% occupancy. And then if you take theater away and all these things that bring people out for that early seating and late seating at that's all gone for a few years. It's prediction that maybe 60% of the operations may go under through this whole thing.

Steve Nygren (39m 21s):
Yeah, that's, that's changes in urban centers.

Katie Kelly Bell (39m 26s):
It's a scary scenario. Yeah. And, and, you know, no one moved to New York to live in their little tiny, tiny, tiny apartment. Like that's the whole point, you know, you, you ignore your apartment and you're out in the city all the time. That's the value of being there. So you're, you're I agree with that completely. Yeah. Yeah.

Monica Olsen (39m 45s):
Is there anything else you want to add or tell us what you're working on right now? What about you, I love your riffing on that great headlines for summer retro travel, and those are great. You gotta write a story now, you know, what are you working on right now? Anything you want to share?

Katie Kelly Bell (40m 0s): 
I'm working on actually rediscovering your backyard. So, you know, it safe, safe, socially safe, socially distant travel.

Katie Kelly Bell (40m 10s):
I'm actually doing, you know, a lot of the stuff I do for Forbes is high high-end networks, private yachts, super yachts. Those are really fun to look at pictures of by the way. So I've been just like, everyone, you know, I'm such a stalker when it comes to the yachts, but that's been a fun story to write because their bookings are through the roof. You know, I mean, if you want a private vacation with your family and you have a million dollars a day to spend well, book a superyacht. Same with private jet travel, that'll be huge. I think that's, you know, a lot of families are sharing jets and just going somewhere together. So those for fun stories to write, you know, I can just lust after that lifestyle. And then still always focused on, I always like to just keep talking about what's happening in the wine world and you know, how, how they're, what's with harvest is like, what the wine making's like, how things are going, you know, life is still happening.

Katie Kelly Bell (41m 4s):
So it's just, it's telling stories and how are you coping? How have you handled it? You know, it's been interesting to see the different experiences everyone has had with this based on where they live and how their life is. So it's been, I've enjoyed that. So those are the, the the chief headlines at the moment.

Monica Olsen (41m 23s):
And then you're off to Hilton Head in a couple of weeks.

Katie Kelly Bell (41m 26s):
And then we go to Hilton Head. Yeah, same. Just bring the laptop, head back down and get the bike and, you know, ride around and walk the dog, play some tennis, walk on the beach.

Monica Olsen (41m 36s):
I think the slowing down is probably great for everybody. Just to reconsider what's important.

Katie Kelly Bell (41m 42s):
Yes. And I, you know, I have to say, I've seen more kids in my neighborhood on a bike than I've ever seen since I've lived here.

Katie Kelly Bell (41m 49s):
Like children I've never even knew lived here. And what I, and what I will tell you is, and they're busy, like school's over. So they're having bike races by my front door all the time. None of them look miserable. They're not, they're not like, oh, darn camp is canceled and baseball's canceled. And they're not really unhappy about it. They're, they're fine. They're figuring it out. They're flipping rocks and finding bugs. And, and, you know, they're making forts in the front yard. I'm just delighted when I walk around the neighborhood and I see all the crazy kid stuff going on. I remember that growing up, but, you know, that's, cause my dad drove us out to the sticks and it was like my sister and my brother, and we had to figure it out, but we had a great time growing up that way. And I feel this has been a great gift to all of us to just really unpack what matters the most and what was sort of, you know, extra and frosting on top, or was it really necessary?

Katie Kelly Bell (42m 38s):
And, you know, I, it's been an unfortunate rough time for so many people and I just hope that part of it changes, but it has the, the silver lining has been that opportunity to just really look at how you're living your life every day and what, what really brings value to you.

Monica Olsen (42m 57s):
Well, thank you so much, Katie. This has been absolutely wonderful. And it's nice to see you again. Definitely we'll have to get you down and introduce you to the wine proprietor. Cause I think you would really enjoy him.

Katie Kelly Bell (43m 8s):
I would love to meet the wine proprietor. I would love it. And it's been such a delight to talk to you and just hear what's going on. And I just, you know, Serenbe's always in my back pocket. Maybe I'll be coming for my next extended stay.

Steve Nygren (43m 21s):
That's right.

Monica Olsen (43m 22s):
We would love to have you.

Steve Nygren (43m 23s):
It's a shorter drive than Hilton head.

Katie Kelly Bell (43m 25s):
That's very true. I don't even have to stop anywhere.

Monica Olsen (43m 28s):
That's right. All right. Well thank you so much, Katie.

Katie Kelly Bell (43m 31s):
Thank you so much.

Steve Nygren (43m 34s):
Appreciate it.

Katie Kelly Bell (43m 34s):
Bye.

Monica Olsen (43m 36s):
There are two rubrics in building a city. You can follow the sprawl mentality or you can preserve land while boosting economic development. Serenbe builds and designs to be both beautiful and environmentally sustainable. If you're a city planner, developer, land owner, or policy maker, there are common sense solutions you can take to build a biophilic centered community. Attend the Nygren place-making conference this fall to learn more. Details at nygrenplacemaking.com. That's nygrenplacemaking.com.

Monica Olsen (44m 17s):
Thank you for listening to Serenbe Stories. New episodes are available on Mondays. Please rate and review the podcast and make sure to email your questions for Steve Nygren to stories@serenbe.com. You may even get to hear them on the podcast. More details about episodes and guests are available on our website serenbestories.com.